So the ZZR1400 is at 56k miles, it's still riding well but with my mileage its time to get something new.
Another ZZR is still a possibility but I'd been keen to hear from anyone who has had the 2 bikes in the title.
Any thoughts?
Had an XR just shy of a year...I can say without fear of contradiction it is a Sportsbike on stilts. They are tall...lowered versions are available but I was advised they are harsh.
Ask me what YOU want to know about the bike and I'll answer as best I can.
GT say no more
I'm 6ft 3 with a 36inch inside leg so superbike on stilts sounds grand!
Mainly interested in quirks, running costs day to day observations on real roads
Did a Euro trip circa 3500 miles...no hanging around some days...others days doing Passes etc...averaged 46mpg over the whole trip...insurance was way cheaper than current S1000R. The engine is a peach...pulls from everywhere...pop it in 6th and it will pull from 25mph to top speed...alternatively rev the nuts in every gear and it turns in to an animal. Switchgear is the weak point so make sure it all works and feels smooth...on cold start ups the Camchain slaps around and sounds like its ready to come through the engine casing...it lasts for about 0.5 of a second until oil pressure builds and fills the adjuster...normal...if it does it for longer there's an issue...revised tensioners or full camchain set. Try and buy a Euro 4 engined bike...bit more power over the whole rev range and soft camshaft issue sorted from 1st generation bike. Handling is top notch...brakes as with all BMW models are superb...they connect with your hand and brain to a level where you just feel the input.
A great bike...if honest a bit tall for me..I returned to an S1000R as I still haven't matured yet despite my birth certificate suggesting otherwise...but it has that engine...that creamy smooth powerhouse that just keeps on giving...this part alone makes me forgive the lesser parts.
No experience of KTM other than a lad on tour has GT...complaints were heat from rear cylinder and mid corner stability had him doubting the bike at times. I had a little tussle with a local on a Superduke 1290 on the XR...it got tasty but neither machine was for giving up.
Hope this helps.
H2 SX If you want the natural successor to the ZZR.
Quote from: David W on January 31, 2019, 07:14:20 AM
H2 SX If you want the natural successor to the ZZR.
It may be suggested...but every test the ZZR has the beating of it...supercharger still doesn't overcome cubic capacity.,
Buying new or used???
The 19MY Superduke GT is very different to the older one with both issues Alzo mentions addressed.
Big bikes are awesome. Depends if you're a v twin winner or IL4 loser really :rofl:
Quote from: The Wizard of MOz on January 31, 2019, 01:07:23 PM
Buying new or used???
The 19MY Superduke GT is very different to the older one with both issues Alzo mentions addressed.
Big bikes are awesome. Depends if you're a v twin loser or IL4 winner really :rofl:
Quote from: The Wizard of MOz on January 31, 2019, 01:07:23 PM
Buying new or used???
The 19MY Superduke GT is very different to the older one with both issues Alzo mentions addressed.
Big bikes are awesome. Depends if you're a v twin winner or IL4 loser really :rofl:
I haven't ridden the KTM but I rented the XR for a day last summer here in Austria while the Euro tour guys were over. I didn't get along with it. Technically, it's a very accomplished machine but something about it and me didn't agree. Particularly when going down to hairpins, the autoblipper on downchanges seemed to shoot me towards the corners I was braking for, and the linked brakes nearly caught me out once when I didn't realise they were linked and I was applying some front and back brake and the rear locked up two or three times and squirmed around as I was trying to get it turned. I was heading worryingly close to a tunnel entrance wall even though I wasn't going particularly fast. :icon_pale: There was very little engine braking too.
I liked the quickshifter, the engine was very smooth and hugely powerful if a bit characterless (I prefer some naughtiness and burbling on the overrun etc). But I've a feeling I would prefer the KTM. I thought I would love the XR but I was wrong. The only way to really know is to try them yourself.
Quote from: Alzo on January 31, 2019, 12:42:42 PM
Quote from: David W on January 31, 2019, 07:14:20 AM
H2 SX If you want the natural successor to the ZZR.
It may be suggested...but every test the ZZR has the beating of it...supercharger still doesn't overcome cubic capacity.,
What tests are they? John McAvoy from PB reckons it runs rings round the ZZR.
Quote from: David W on January 31, 2019, 01:58:52 PM
Quote from: Alzo on January 31, 2019, 12:42:42 PM
Quote from: David W on January 31, 2019, 07:14:20 AM
H2 SX If you want the natural successor to the ZZR.
It may be suggested...but every test the ZZR has the beating of it...supercharger still doesn't overcome cubic capacity.,
What tests are they? John McAvoy from PB reckons it runs rings round the ZZR.
One example...more to be found if you look.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.motorcyclenews.com/amp/news/2018/march/kawasaki-h2-sx-zzr1400-dyno/
Quote from: Raydial on January 31, 2019, 01:58:35 PM
Quote from: The Wizard of MOz on January 31, 2019, 01:07:23 PM
Buying new or used???
The 19MY Superduke GT is very different to the older one with both issues Alzo mentions addressed.
Big bikes are awesome. Depends if you're a v twin winner or IL4 loser really :rofl:
I haven't ridden the KTM but I rented the XR for a day last summer here in Austria while the Euro tour guys were over. I didn't get along with it. Technically, it's a very accomplished machine but something about it and me didn't agree. Particularly when going down to hairpins, the autoblipper on downchanges seemed to shoot me towards the corners I was braking for, and the linked brakes nearly caught me out once when I didn't realise they were linked and I was applying some front and back brake and the rear locked up two or three times and squirmed around as I was trying to get it turned. I was heading worryingly close to a tunnel entrance wall even though I wasn't going particularly fast. :icon_pale: There was very little engine braking too.
I liked the quickshifter, the engine was very smooth and hugely powerful if a bit characterless (I prefer some naughtiness and burbling on the overrun etc). But I've a feeling I would prefer the KTM. I thought I would love the XR but I was wrong. The only way to really know is to try them yourself.
It's great we're all different...I couldn't live with a V-Twin...actually I still find it incredible they still make them.
personally prefer the characteristics of a v-twin
the torque
the engine braking
the noise
and i suspect so do a lot of other people... and that is why they are still making them
this would be a no brainer for me, superduke all day long
Quote from: komp on January 31, 2019, 04:30:25 PM
personally prefer the characteristics of a v-twin
the torque
the engine braking
the noise
and i suspect so do a lot of other people... and that is why they are still making them
this would be a no brainer for me, superduke all day long
I'm only winding up Moz...all bikes are ace regardless of piston counts...and each to their own. 😊
Quote from: Alzo on January 31, 2019, 05:47:54 PM
Quote from: komp on January 31, 2019, 04:30:25 PM
personally prefer the characteristics of a v-twin
the torque
the engine braking
the noise
and i suspect so do a lot of other people... and that is why they are still making them
this would be a no brainer for me, superduke all day long
I'm only winding up Moz...all bikes are ace regardless of piston counts...and each to their own. 😊
i suspected that was the case, but thought i would bite anyway :)
Quote from: komp on January 31, 2019, 06:00:48 PM
Quote from: Alzo on January 31, 2019, 05:47:54 PM
Quote from: komp on January 31, 2019, 04:30:25 PM
personally prefer the characteristics of a v-twin
the torque
the engine braking
the noise
and i suspect so do a lot of other people... and that is why they are still making them
this would be a no brainer for me, superduke all day long
I'm only winding up Moz...all bikes are ace regardless of piston counts...and each to their own. 😊
i suspected that was the case, but thought i would bite anyway :)
:rofl: :moto: :moto:
It's not winding me up.
Personally, I'd be more than happy with either GT or XR as a sports tourer.
Naked nutter toy is a different proposition. Having owned both the Alzo mobile and now a SDR I know which one is vastly superior in every way.
Quote from: The Wizard of MOz on January 31, 2019, 07:45:23 PM
It's not winding me up.
Personally, I'd be more than happy with either GT or XR as a sports toured.
Naked nutter toy is a different proposition. Having owned both the Alzo mobile and now a SDR I know which one is vastly superior in every way.
You really do talk out your ass...you haven't lived with either long enough to have an opinion...and my 2018 model is an improvement over the older you had.
Come back with a review when you've ridden and lived with the bikes you buy...mileage counts...not sat in your garage for 12 months...I did 12k miles on GS...I did 9k on XR...I did 9k on older S1000R...qualifies me to pass a reasoned opinion.
When I go looking for opinions on bikes I seek out longterm owner videos...not some journo who has bike for 10 minutes...you sit in the latter.
What's worse though is you actually believe yourself...nobody else does.
There are very little posts on this forum...so when someone does ask something I know about I take the time to give an honest answer.
:tongue:
Okay...I'll give you that one...I bit...hook...line and sinker.
If you've got any feel for a bike you can tell very quickly the differences between them.
Quote from: David W on February 01, 2019, 07:12:49 AM
If you've got any feel for a bike you can tell very quickly the differences between them.
To a point yes...but is it not reasonable to say that someone who has ridden a bike and lived with a bike will have a more rounded overview...have you never ridden a bike or drove a car and something that you initially didn't like actually turns out to be less significant...and on the flip side something you hadn't realised on a test ride becomes very significant.
The best example for me was a 2003 Yamaha R1...test ride I was blown away with looks and engine...to the point I never picked up on the worst feeling front end I have ever had...time brought that to the fore.
Quote from: Alzo on February 01, 2019, 06:52:13 AM
Okay...I'll give you that one...I bit...hook...line and sinker.
I suppose we all have a "fed up of banter" limit.....
I forget considering my job that other's banter thresholds are probably a lot lower than mine.
I did say I would be well happy with either bike. I think they're both awesome.
BTW - I had my S1R for a year. Liked it but just soulless. Great bike but dare I say it - boring.
SDR only took a 3 hour test ride to know it was the one for me and better (for me) than the Beemer.
Quote from: The Wizard of MOz on February 01, 2019, 09:41:11 AM
Quote from: Alzo on February 01, 2019, 06:52:13 AM
Okay...I'll give you that one...I bit...hook...line and sinker.
I suppose we all have a "fed up of banter" limit.....
I forget considering my job that other's banter thresholds are probably a lot lower than mine.
I did say I would be well happy with either bike. I think they're both awesome.
I thinks it's more an age thing...as in I can be a grumpy old bastard...🙄...😊
Quote from: The Wizard of MOz on February 01, 2019, 09:43:29 AM
BTW - I had my S1R for a year. Liked it but just soulless. Great bike but dare I say it - boring.
SDR only took a 3 hour test ride to know it was the one for me and better (for me) than the Beemer.
I love the S1000R...hence back at it...it does everything so well...I rode a Monster R recently and I wouldn't take 10 of them in replacement of my S1000R...the Boxer twin on the GS had more character than the Monster...all the machines are so close in each segment in performance terms it comes down personal choice...so saying one is way better than the other is just personal choice...the bike you just bought is a cracking looking bit of kit...but like mine it will not be flawless and it most definitely isn't superior...fact.
And my final say on this...we are on a motorcycle forum and that alone should be enough for us to respect and encourage others choices...I don't need to defend or justify the S1000R...my choice...as the Superduke is yours...the end.
And now for some politics.......
(https://media.giphy.com/media/4wAO1N5uusbMQ/giphy.gif)
Quote from: Alzo on February 01, 2019, 07:23:17 AMhave you never ridden a bike or drove a car and something that you initially didn't like actually turns out to be less significant...and on the flip side something you hadn't realised on a test ride becomes very significant.
I remember you saying more-or-less that back in August. That initially you found the riding position on the XR weird, having come off something less sitty-uppy. But then you got used to it and appreciated all of the other qualities of the bike. The same might have happened to me if I'd had it for longer than a day.
Quote from: Raydial on February 01, 2019, 01:42:12 PM
Quote from: Alzo on February 01, 2019, 07:23:17 AMhave you never ridden a bike or drove a car and something that you initially didn't like actually turns out to be less significant...and on the flip side something you hadn't realised on a test ride becomes very significant.
I remember you saying more-or-less that back in August. That initially you found the riding position on the XR weird, having come off something less sitty-uppy. But then you got used to it and appreciated all of the other qualities of the bike. The same might have happened to me if I'd had it for longer than a day.
Yip...even going back to the S1000R took time...it now feels natural...I don't think anyone can form a full opinion until you live with a bike. I have had a few...and some great bikes...the S1000R rates as the best...closely followed by GS...and 3rd to that was the Speed Triple R and for different reasons...of the 30 bikes I've had these are the three I'd keep.
Still think the H2SX is worth a look....
Many reports that the bike won't work properly on a dyno because the front wheel isn't turning.
https://h2sxriders.net/derestricted-h2sx/
I flicked between liking the design then not liking the design...expensive for the SE model...and it would need to be the bells and whistles one.
Quote from: Alzo on February 02, 2019, 01:53:19 PM
I flicked between liking the design then not liking the design...expensive for the SE model...and it would need to be the bells and whistles one.
I think they are fugly, but they seem to do the job. Love it or hate it styling I guess.
I had a good look over one in a dealers in Cadiz last year...I was impressed with the quality...it looked well finished and well screwed together...and it's a Supercharged 1000cc motorcycle...so loads to like just there.
Back to XR vs GT.
I truly think it will come down to which engine config you prefer. Both bikes are awesome.
Let us know what happens going forward.
I'm less concerned about funny auto blooper issues etc...
I do a lot of miles and most of them are commuting. But I still go out at the weekend and will do the very occasionally trackday.
There are very few bikes that allow me to do all the above.
On the H2SX versus ZZR argument. There is nothing in speed wise, but the H2 looks a whole generation on from th ZZR also there are already folks remapping them to use more of the Supercharger for 240-250bhp. That's appealing
Quote from: LewisBeGoog on February 02, 2019, 09:23:11 PM
I'm less concerned about funny auto blooper issues etc...
I do a lot of miles and most of them are commuting. But I still go out at the weekend and will do the very occasionally trackday.
There are very few bikes that allow me to do all the above.
The XR will do the above...You Tube video put an XR up against RR...forget the track...but 1 second difference in lap times.
https://youtu.be/_bgRN1neGVM
Quote from: terry950sm on February 04, 2019, 06:47:19 PM
https://youtu.be/_bgRN1neGVM
Only one opinion...and by that I mean he waxed lyrical for 2 years how good the XR was...then at the drop of a hat now waxes lyrical about the GT...and he is a bit of a bellend too...I'm not defending the XR...I'm berating his credibility.
https://youtu.be/UAqyhxS40Nc
Quote from: terry950sm on February 06, 2019, 09:02:23 PM
https://youtu.be/UAqyhxS40Nc
Great looking bike...better than previous...but by God his voice is a cure for insomnia.